The Flow: Episode 62 - 2023 Video Podcasting Takeaways

# The FLOW EP.62

[00:00:00] **Doc Rock:** And welcome to another edition of The Flow. I am your community manager here at Ecamm, Doc Rock, along with.

[00:00:33] **Katie Fawkes:** Katie!

[00:00:36] **Doc Rock:** Katie! Hello, Katie! Hi! How's it going? Kimberly said that your water cup is southern coffee. I know exactly what that means since I was stationed in Georgia for a little bit. Anyway, gang, we are going to dive in and do our final episode of the year.

[00:00:54] **Doc Rock:** And then, uh, we're gonna take our Christmas, uh, sabbatical, and it will be back in January. So, first of all, I just wanna thank everybody who kicked it with us this entire year, and came to the live shows, and had a lot of fun. And those of you guys who can't make it, who listened on the replays, I just, uh, first of Thank you for taking the time to do such a thing.

[00:01:13] **Doc Rock:** I hope we can keep providing you with awesome information that you can use to us, I don't know, start your video podcast and grow that thing.

[00:01:22] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah, yeah, and like this is an incredible time whether you've been with us from the start or you are just finding this because we're in we're heading into our kind of planning and implementation working holiday, so if there's a topic we haven't covered or you're like, wow, I really wish that they would go more in detail on this particular thing, send it over to us.

[00:01:43] **Katie Fawkes:** You can always email us flow at Ecamm. com, E C A M M. com, um, and we, yeah, we're always up for taking your ideas. We're going to be, you know, outlining all of our shows for at least the, you know, next, the first few months of 2024, along with some amazing guests. And we're going to do a few updates to our process and to how the show appears in all these different places and spaces.

[00:02:05] **Katie Fawkes:** So yeah, let us know if any questions come up along the way while we're working hard and hardly working in my dad, in my dad joke mode.

[00:02:16] **Doc Rock:** I like it. I like it. Okay. So what are we talking about this week, Kate?

[00:02:19] **Katie Fawkes:** We are talking about our takeaways. We've done this episode before, but I figured since this was our last one of the year, we would take a moment to look back over 2023 and yeah, share some of the cool things that we learned about podcasting, about video podcasting, about YouTube podcasts, everything in this space.

[00:02:38] **Katie Fawkes:** What do you, what do you got? What's your biggest one?

[00:02:41] **Doc Rock:** Uh, okay. So, for me, one of my biggest takeaways of the year is YouTube is serious. Like, they're not playing, right? And it's funny because I've had this conversation, I told everybody that it was coming, people thought I was crazy, and that's not to be the I Told You So person.

[00:03:03] **Doc Rock:** Okay, kinda is a little bit. Um. It's because when I went to Podcast Movement, I had an opportunity to talk to Kai himself, right? So he's the head of podcast at YouTube, and he's like, yeah, we're all in, like, this is a real thing. Now, the weird part about that is if you ask the OGs, like myself, um, although I don't agree with the OGs on this.

[00:03:32] **Doc Rock:** A lot of people, looking directly at you, Tom, um, they really think that having the RSS connection is super important, and I know why they think that, because that's the way it's always been, but we're at a cusp and a turning point where it doesn't matter as much, and I, you know, not even trying to guesstimate, but if I went through the amount of people in the audience who have been subscribed to podcasts, uh, listening to podcasts, watching podcasts, whatever, and asked them, like, tell me exactly what an RSS feed does.

[00:04:10] **Doc Rock:** I will say 80 percent of them will look at me like I'm high. So, it's funny because the OG podcasters, because that's the way it used to be, are very much hung up on having that RSS feed, but trust the general podcast user has no clue what that is, and they don't subscribe via RSS feed any longer. They go through the podcast aggregators.

[00:04:35] **Doc Rock:** Now, if the podcast aggregators have a way to connect to your feed without using RSS, this thing that can break, and anybody who's ever opened their podcast ad and all of their episodes are shuffled or missing or lost, or whenever someone wants to move a podcast to a different, say, um, provider, say you were on, on like Wondery because they paid for you, but then you broke up with Wondery and you went to go do your own thing.

[00:05:02] **Doc Rock:** All your episodes, like you might want to take it with you. The RSS feed normally works. Sometimes it doesn't. So I've been through those where podcast episodes completely got jacked because the RSS feed broke. So I think YouTube is like, yeah, we don't even need to bother with that anymore because we have far better search capabilities.

[00:05:20] **Doc Rock:** We are SEO. Like, it was like, how do you SEO? I don't know, ask Google. They're in charge of it. Whether you like it or not, it's their game. So, uh, they don't really need it. So, yeah, I think that's kind of a, that's been a big takeaway for me is YouTube is dead serious with or without the RSS feed, but pro tip, secret squirrel, you heard it here first, Kai says they are going to bring SSS feed sooner or later.

[00:05:44] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah. Yeah, I think one of the things that I've seen throughout this year is really just this, like, Blending of, of all of these content formats, right? So it used to be like, I feel like everything was fairly separate, right? So like you maybe had a podcast, maybe you had a live show, you had social accounts, you had your community, you had like all these different kinds of marketing channels and spaces that people were creating content for.

[00:06:08] **Katie Fawkes:** And over the last year, it's really become pretty like squishy and blended in that you can really, you know, create content one time and be able to actually really leverage that in a number of different ways where that was never something that you could easily do before. If you did, it was, it, it felt, I'm trying to think of a better word than like in, inauthentic, right?

[00:06:35] **Katie Fawkes:** Like if you posted to your Facebook, you know, something, and then you just copy and pasted that over, you know, into Instagram or, you know, copy and pasted that into something else. It felt like you weren't creating for the platform, whereas now I feel like it's, you know, you can kind of be on all of these different places in all of these different ways, but you don't necessarily have to be reinventing the wheel every single time.

[00:06:57] **Katie Fawkes:** And I feel like podcasts have become really central to that, and video podcasts in particular have made it significantly easier. So it's, uh, it's an interesting space because I feel like now if you say, you know, do you have a podcast or do you have a show, it means something a lot bigger than what it meant even a year ago or two years ago or five years ago.

[00:07:19] **Doc Rock:** Yes, it is a fantastic way to let your greatness shine, if you will. But also, to take your users with you on a ride, give them a spot for familiarity, things of that nature, which before was a little bit different, so, yeah, I think having, having podcasts as part of your overall identity is kind of a big thing nowadays.

[00:07:43] **Doc Rock:** So yeah, I agree with that. That's kind of cool. And I like, I like how you call it the blending of the various, um, channels, because that's also something that people are super terrified about. You know, going back to my original takeaway about, well, YouTube, and they're like, oh, well, do I gotta make a whole separate channel for my podcast, and, you know, blah, blah, blah, and the answer is no.

[00:08:06] **Doc Rock:** Not if your podcast is an extension of the show that you're already doing, or the content you're already doing. No, you don't. And Kai was super clear about that, and yet, I see a bunch of my fellow YouTube coaching friends telling everybody to, oh, make another channel, because if you put podcasts on YouTube, it's gonna break your channel.

[00:08:25] **Doc Rock:** So... And, you know, this, that, and the third. And you don't have to do that, and the reason is what you just said. There's a blending of your various platforms, and, this is so weird, we were going away from the, uh, I don't want to call it the identity channel, but the personality channel, right? We were going away from the personality channel, which was like, before, you would subscribe to.

[00:08:57] **Doc Rock:** Oprah on, uh, Oprah, and you would see her differently on a different thing, and a different thing on a different thing, but what you're really doing... is going to see Oprah, right? It wasn't a matter of whether she was doing cooking, or books, or you get a chair. Oh, wait, that's under the chair. No, whatever. It was still her, right?

[00:09:22] **Doc Rock:** And so eventually, she created her own network, get it? Own network to Oprah Winfrey. It's kind of, I mean, brilliant how that plays out. It's her own network, but then it's her own network and her initials. OpenWebVNetwork, uh, you whatever. So, she basically recreated the Hallmark Channel for herself. Yeah, and it works because it just is what it is.

[00:09:47] **Doc Rock:** Mel, you're a city council person, so fix the internet. No, I'm joking.

[00:09:53] **Katie Fawkes:** Um, yeah, I think it's interesting, and I'm seeing some questions coming in that fall under kind of the topic that you, that you were just discussing, where what's kind of cool about something like YouTube. Is that any of us can be Oprah in this particular instance, right?

[00:10:10] **Katie Fawkes:** Like we can create our own network and space. And the way that that YouTube has devised their podcast is that they're basically a playlist. So that means that again, they're, they're trying to force you. Not to do what you want to do, which is like create, you know, a YouTube specifically for The Flow. They want The Flow and potentially many other podcasts to sit as podcast playlists, you know, underneath a main channel.

[00:10:38] **Katie Fawkes:** So underneath. A network, right? So, so the concept is that you really can build your own network of different shows and different kinds of videos and different things that delight your audience and your community kind of all sitting under this one umbrella brand or network. So, so yeah, so that for those of you who are asking, like, you know, how do I, like, can I add multiple podcasts, you know, under my, under my channel?

[00:11:02] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah. They literally on YouTube function the same way as a playlist. So you can really build like all of these different shows so that people can discover you in one place. And if they love one show, you know, then maybe they're more likely to check out some of your other content. So thinking about that kind of, and then I like how you, how you said doc and kind of that network idea, like I think is really smart.

[00:11:23] **Katie Fawkes:** It's a really, it's a great way to approach it.

[00:11:26] **Doc Rock:** Yeah, like be your own network, and I don't mean you have to go to Captivate and sign up for a network account and build your own, you know, um, My problem is if you want to, knock yourself out. What I mean by be your own network is today you are the video creator and the business owner And the janitor, and the accountant, to a certain point, don't, don't pull, uh, like some recent accounting mistakes.

[00:11:50] **Doc Rock:** Um, you are the marketing department and the social media manager, so yeah, you do have to sort of be your own network and give yourself availability and space to shine on all the platforms. I think one of the biggest challenges is people start their sentence out with this all too much, and I fight against that, and I'm not, at this point in time, I give up.

[00:12:11] **Doc Rock:** I cannot stop you guys from saying overwhelm, so keep psyching yourself out. I don't do that to me. Like, I don't care how much it is, I got this. Right, even when it's killing me. I'm like, okay, you have no choice, dude It's not like you can just quit so even if it's all too much you still have no choice You still have to do it.

[00:12:30] **Doc Rock:** Katie is still waiting for you to send her something by the end of the day Luis is still waiting for you to do this, Paul is still waiting for you to do this, the community is waiting for you to do this. It doesn't matter if it's too much, I don't really have a choice, let's do it. So you can keep psyching yourself out and give yourself the fear words that really do slow you down, or you can be like, I kinda gotta do this anyway, so just let me knock it out.

[00:12:52] **Doc Rock:** So yes, you don't have enough time, none of us do. Right? Yeah. And even those of us who enjoy sitting back and watching the occasional two hour, uh, football match from a team in the UK, you know what? I find the time to do that. So if I can find the time to do that, I always have time to do whatever else.

[00:13:13] **Doc Rock:** Because trust you me, I'm going to find the time to watch my Manchester United.

[00:13:17] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah,

[00:13:18] **Katie Fawkes:** which actually is another, I think, and Jeff mentioned this in the chat, but is another big takeaway for this year, and you were talking about it right before we jumped on today's episode, but ways to, you know, simplify your workflow and create a lot of efficiencies and save yourself time.

[00:13:35] **Katie Fawkes:** AI has obviously become a huge, huge part of many of our, hopefully everyone's, world to some extent. Hopefully you've tested it and tried it out and kind of figured out what works for you and what doesn't. But Doc, what, you know, in the world of AI, what have podcasters been doing in this space or what have you been seeing?

[00:13:55] **Doc Rock:** Number one, the biggest thing before was where to come up with like various show ideas. That part is crazy because You can completely do that with AI Now you can export a list of the titles and descriptions of all of your recent shows. You probably already have them because if you wrote them in Word, Excel, PowerPoint, Apple Notes, Drafts, Notion, ClickUp, whatever.

[00:14:21] **Doc Rock:** Just export all of those titles and descriptions. Save them into a single file. Upload it to ChatGPT and be like, Okay, these were the last 10 episodes of my show. Give me some more ideas. It's not just going to pull random ideas out of his ukulele, it's going to take what you've given it... And give you the next 10 and you know, the funny part is I pretty much put bank on 9 out of the 10 of them are going to be glorious, right?

[00:14:51] **Doc Rock:** If you feed it more than your last 10 episodes, all 10 of them are going to be glorious and it's going to go from your channel. You could even go as far as to export your analytics, so for us, we have Captivate, I can take the Captivate Dashboard, and if I can't find the Export button in Captivate Dashboard, because, I don't know, I've been smoking some of Kauai's finest, screenshot it, and send it the screenshot, it knows what it's looking at.

[00:15:19] **Doc Rock:** So it will look at your analytics and it will say, okay, I just did this. Trust me. I know it says your audience is primarily between the ages of 34 and 65. And these are the things they're looking for based on us checking the search. And it gave me the freaking list. And as I looked at the list. I was like, well, Shuck E.

[00:15:43] **Doc Rock:** Dern, that's absolutely correct. So, those excuses are gone. Use these tools, man. Like, use these tools. You can do show notes. You can help, you know, write that email to get the guest on your show. Uh, real quick, last one was really funny. I got an email from a company that wants me to check out some more Blinky Lights because they saw about Blinky Lights.

[00:16:03] **Doc Rock:** So, like, we want to send you the Blinky Lights. And then, I um, I said, listen, I don't have time to write this email, but I do want to answer these guys because I kind of think they're, they're neat, and I might want to check it out. So I was like, Ted, here's an email that I got from Kevin at Moon Designs.

[00:16:23] **Doc Rock:** And, uh, can you answer Kevin, but please tell him I don't do negative reviews, so yeah, I'm willing to look at it, but if I don't like it, I ain't saying nothing, and I'm probably not gonna, you know, write back, but if I love it, I'll make a video for Amazon, Jeff, and for YouTube and for Instagram. And then, Chad wrote the beautiful email, and I was like, oh, snap, I should have been doing this before.

[00:16:43] **Doc Rock:** I just had been not, because I'm like, uh, Chad can't write emails the way I write emails. Chad writes emails. Good emails.

[00:16:51] **Katie Fawkes:** So if you're like, who is Chad? Doc is talking about ChatGPT, which you can access a number of different account levels on it, but I think that's what Kimberly is asking there in the chat.

[00:17:03] **Katie Fawkes:** But yeah, I think that there's a ton of different ways that you can really leverage it, whether it's coming up with, you know, show ideas, definitely coming up with your podcast avatar, so your audience, like trying to figure out the best way, Doc's talked about that a lot, is really a, you know, great way to approach it.

[00:17:20] **Katie Fawkes:** Um, ask common, like ask it for common questions in the topic that you're in, like that might spark some ideas for cool ways that you can go, you know, cool topics that you can dive deeper into or what your avatar is looking for, what your, what your audience is looking for. So there's, yeah, lots, lots and lots of different ideas there, but, um, those who are using this are saving themselves a ton of time.

[00:17:42] **Katie Fawkes:** And the other, the other kind of aspect of AI that, that we've talked about a little bit on this show, although I think we should definitely dive deeper for next year. is, you know, in this whole like content repurposing space. So over the last few years, we've heard a lot about content repurposing and video repurposing.

[00:17:58] **Katie Fawkes:** There are now a ton of tools out there. Opus Clip is one of them that we have brought on and talked with a bunch, but where you can literally share your full, you know, video podcast episode, and it will use AI to grab the best sound bites, the best video clips, the best parts of that. Clip it all up, even put the, the captions burned right on the video so that then you can share those out.

[00:18:22] **Katie Fawkes:** So there's lots of ways to, to save yourself on the post production side of it, right? Which tends to be the side that many of us are, um, you know, it's just, it's, it's costing us the most amount of time or the most amount of money is trying to do these really. You know, convoluted post production editing workflows when we are not ourselves editors or you know, don't know exactly know what the best tools are to use.

[00:18:45] **Katie Fawkes:** I think AI can save a ton of time in those spaces, um, or just approaching those workflows evenly a little differently would make a big difference too.

[00:18:54] **Doc Rock:** A hundred percent. Okay, so my other takeaway is, and it kind of lines up with what we were just talking about, is... Do not be afraid of video. Video is easier than ever before.

[00:19:12] **Doc Rock:** That is legit my entire takeaway. Do not be afraid of video. Video is easier than ever before. And even though my, a lot of my contemporaries are like, audio is still the king, which they are correct. It is 100 percent still the king. You doing it as a recording, doing it as a video, being able to see you and Luis here now at the same time, doing this live is so much easier.

[00:19:35] **Doc Rock:** Then just talking to themself now even if I'm looking at myself on the camera as I record my audio if no guest was there It was a solo podcast still talking and looking at the camera and you know, I don't stare at it directly Even when I'm doing the stream I don't stare at the camera all the time like I kind of like look all over the room and do what I would normally do if I was talking to a person it's just easier. It literally is easier if for nothing else.

[00:20:02] **Doc Rock:** It definitely makes your editing easier because, you can see your face right when you make a mistake and you cringe, you can just know that's a thing you need to scrub and fix, or a thing you need to pull and highlight. And the other great part of doing the video, whether you're going to use the video or not, is exactly what you just said.

[00:20:21] **Doc Rock:** When you go to build your promo clips... Or your clips for TikTok to grow that audience or whatever. It's already there. Like you just literally drop it into an AI app like Opus Clips or there's many others out there and you're good to go. Like you're absolutely. Good to go.

[00:20:40] **Katie Fawkes:** So some of them will even schedule, schedule the schedule, the, uh, the videos out for you into like a, into any of your social accounts as well.

[00:20:48] **Katie Fawkes:** Like it is remarkable. Correct. With and will write the little blurbs for you . So like, it is amazing depending on what your, you know, what your budget is and what like, how into it you want to get. There are more and more, you know, a lot of these tools are becoming more accessible to all of us where it, it really is like having a

[00:21:05] **Katie Fawkes:** an entire assistant to be able to do everything for you in, in minutes, whereas it would take a human, you know, certainly at least an hour

[00:21:13] **Katie Fawkes:** if not two.

[00:21:15] **Doc Rock:** So yeah, literally like, like LD does it with an iPhone and a short MV88 plus mic and just set it up on the table with the tripod the MV88 comes with. And just record it in the hotel, and then she might throw the video away, but the audio is clean, you know, and you can take little promo clips out of that, in your phone, open up your CapCut, or your InShot, or your iMovie, or whatever else you're using, and slice and dice that bad boy, and now you got clips for your instance.

[00:21:45] **Doc Rock:** And for your TikTok and for your YouTube Shorts to help promote this show. So like, legit, now is the time for all good men to come to the age that can start a typing class. Um, now is more than ever the time to jump in the video space and... It's funny. I did want to make sure that I cover something that I saw that was missed.

[00:22:07] **Doc Rock:** Johnny asked the question, Um, if you're doing this on YouTube, right, can you have more than one show on the same channel? Absolutely, because in YouTube the shows are playlists. You literally just make a playlist. So if you can have multiple playlists, then you're good to go. And then the other one was Neil had mentioned, right, if the video content shouldn't allow you to repurpose the audio version of a show, Uh, yeah, you can just script the audio and let it go.

[00:22:33] **Doc Rock:** Like, literally just script the audio, take the audio version, send it up as is. Or you could take the audio version and polish that a little bit, right? Because I think the video side is more forgiving because there's a face there. So I can see your, your tonalities, your nuances, your, your inflict, inflections, inflections.

[00:22:52] **Doc Rock:** Inflections. And you can see those visually, so you don't have to edit as much maybe, whereas in an audio podcast, you might. Put in a sound, you know, blast in order to make a point stick or something of that nature. So yes, you can just strip your audio and go with it. And I guess the last thing I want to add to this and before I pass the mic is Okay.

[00:23:14] **Doc Rock:** So now that we're not afraid of video, you don't have to know how to edit. Don't freaking edit it. Nobody cares about your mistake. You know why? They make mistakes. You can just leave the mistake and giggle your way through it. As you get better at editing, you give it like, Hey guys, guess what? I edited this one and they're going to be like, Oh yeah, you finally made it.

[00:23:37] **Doc Rock:** Your people don't ride with you, man. As long as you're giving good value, you're sharing the Aloha and you're telling them something that they want or giving them a place to be or making them feel welcome. It doesn't matter if you have to stop and be like, Oh my God, my kid just came down. Hold on, just leave it.

[00:23:56] **Doc Rock:** Like, no big deal. Don't, don't psych yourself out over, I don't want to do video because I don't know how to use Final Cut. Final Cut ain't none of your business. Just leave it unedited or open up the script and you know how to use words so you know how to use Descript.

[00:24:11] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah, I, I do almost everything now.

[00:24:15] **Katie Fawkes:** They're just live and then grab the, you know, grab the files and, and, you know, maybe I'm processing it like I'm taking the audio out so I can send it through to a, to a podcast host. But in many cases... You know, you can just send the video through and it'll do it for you. You don't even, you don't even need to strip the audio out.

[00:24:33] **Katie Fawkes:** You know, usually it'll, it'll receive different, um, different file formats and be able to do that aspect for you. But my, one of the, one of the things, and I, I'm embarrassed to say it took me like way longer to figure out this easy hack than it should have, but. Um, so obviously Doc and I are both Ecamm users, we do this show for Ecamm, and one of the features in Ecamm is that you can have profiles and then you can have scenes, right?

[00:24:55] **Katie Fawkes:** So a profile is a show in the same way that like a playlist defines each show, a profile has everything you need to record and create your show. So, I do a podcast for fun, all about movies, and so I have my, uh, profile for that, and then in my profile I have all my scenes, my little, you know, intro, uh, countdown timer, the one that's like, this one with just me and Nat, and then I created a scene at the bottom that's just like my promo scene, I think I call it vertical, it's just called vertical, and when I'm setting up for my show, like in the, you know, hour before I'm getting ready to record, and I'm just making sure everything looks great.

[00:25:29] **Katie Fawkes:** I just, and I have all my talking points like literally in front of me for the episode, I just go down to that vertical scene and I change the video format from wide to vertical in Ecamm so I'm record, I'm able to record in vertical and I just record my promo. When I'm done recording, then I switch it back to wide and I go back to the scenes that I want, and then I can record my show.

[00:25:50] **Katie Fawkes:** And so I have both of those. I don't even need to repurpose. I don't need to send it through to, you know, to Opus or drop it into Descript, or do any of these other things that I did before. Uh, I can if I want to, if I want to grab like extra additional things, I know those tools are there and they make it really easy for me to do it, but I don't need to.

[00:26:07] **Katie Fawkes:** I can have the video created in the format that I need it in. It's on point. It's, you know, it's short enough that I can use it on TikTok shorts. And it. It adds maybe a minute to my workflow. I'm already there on my recording space. I try to keep them under a minute so that I can get into that YouTube Shorts category and, and I now do that for every single episode and it's like one extra piece of content created and it's, and it saves me a ton of time.

[00:26:38] **Katie Fawkes:** So, You know, I, and again, that was just me thinking through, I don't want to edit, but I don't want to spend a ton of time figuring out how to repurpose all this content that I have that I know is great. And it was like, maybe I don't repurpose it. Maybe I just record the extra stuff that I need in the format that I need it in.

[00:26:55] **Doc Rock:** Man, you just said everything that you need to say right there. I think it's super important that while you have your scene set up, you're already sitting at your table. You're already doing it. Do yourself the favor. Do your promos at the very end of your show. Uh, Leo from TWiT, we've been doing them like this forever.

[00:27:16] **Doc Rock:** Anybody who's ever watched the live tapings on Twit, we do this forever. The other thing is, while you're there, You're already set up and you're ready. Your brain is flushed. You got a piece so you'll spend less time making mistakes So do your promos, but do your your reels that you're supposed to do to grow your channel.

[00:27:33] **Doc Rock:** Do your TikToks You're supposed to do you grow your channel and give yourself a brief Overview or synopsis of your channel and save that as a journal and so you can look at it and watch yourself grow You know, I mean, it's it's kind of a it's kind of a big deal. I think it's a huge idea

[00:27:49] **Katie Fawkes:** And what makes it easy too, just as a note, is that like having a format for it also makes it easy to replicate, right?

[00:27:58] **Katie Fawkes:** So in this particular case, again, it's like a movie review show. So I just do it in the, like, I know I'm researching facts and trivia for the movie. So I'm like, here are my top three facts from this movie, right? So I know, like, I don't even have to think about it. It's like, I have my notes. I know exactly what this video is going to be.

[00:28:14] **Katie Fawkes:** I have 58 seconds or whatever, you know, under a minute time that I need to get out these three facts and that's it. And so then it's like, I don't, it, it removes the ability to even overthink it or think about it at all. Like it's just, it's every time it's going to be three facts. It's like, we're doing a different movie every single time.

[00:28:31] **Katie Fawkes:** So think through like what your thing is for your promo, because I have been in those instances where. You're at the end of a show and you're trying to record the promo for it and you're like a guest that's on, or you have a guest that's on, and you're like, okay, what do we say, and you kind of lose a lot of time feeling awkward not knowing what to record, so just have a, like, have a template in mind.

[00:28:49] **Katie Fawkes:** You don't have to even write it down, but just know that, like, these short videos are always going to be XYZ thing, like, XYZ format, XYZ template, so that if you have a guest, you're like, okay, hey, doc, like, You know, you were my guest this episode for my show. Like, I want you to share your three favorite things about this movie.

[00:29:06] **Katie Fawkes:** Or you, you know, I want you to share your top podcasting tip. And then, you know, and then your guest knows what to say and you grab the recording and you haven't wasted everyone's time. So part of it is knowing kind of what what is in that space as well.

[00:29:18] **Doc Rock:** Man, listen, you just said something that reminded me we need to go back and call our friend Jeff I don't know if he ever listens to this show or whatever To talk about what he does and the reason why I say that if I go to my mentions right now There was a post on November 7th, and it says I'm on X, right, the artist formerly known as Twitter.

[00:29:44] **Doc Rock:** It says, Jeff, uh, why build a community, Doc Rock gives you examples you might have heard of. Watch, listen to the entire episode here, powered by Ecamm, there's a link. Yep. Listen, people. Listen to this. I'm reading this to you and I know you're at home and you don't have a TV in front of you. Can't see. I'm not even showing this on screen.

[00:30:03] **Doc Rock:** I'm keeping it fair. But let me, let me explain this again. Jeff on November 7th posted this tweet and it talks about something that I said in the episode. It has a link that promos to that episode, but then it has a link that promos the affiliate for Ecamm because when I look at this screenshot, which is actually a video, it's a small little clip about yo big, uh, let's call it.

[00:30:28] **Doc Rock:** Oh, it's 60 seconds. I can see the timer. Um, there's my head talking. There's words around it and it has a social media news icon. And the reason why I bring this up is Jeff has been sending this same tweet from this episode for over two years. And how do I know this? Because it was my beard. I remember it was like his.

[00:30:51] **Doc Rock:** Now I don't have one. I cut it like a year ago, right before I went to Japan. So, also my background is a little different. Like I know my studio, right? So Jeff built this clip all in the script as he's telling you folks in the chat. And he has this thing set to automatically tweet every so often, cause if I scroll back again, that same tweet came from Social Media News Live, and it was earlier.

[00:31:17] **Doc Rock:** And then, I'm gonna scroll back a little bit more, it's from Jeff again, and it's a little bit earlier. So, Jeff and Stephanie have clips that are basically me on their show, but they're still promoting it, and I haven't been on Jeff's show for over a year. Because after I cut my beard, he don't want to be my friend no more, jerk.

[00:31:37] **Doc Rock:** Um,

[00:31:38] **Katie Fawkes:** but the content is still relevant, so like, people can do that because great hosts like both Stephanie and Jeff, shout out to them, I see them hanging out in the chat with us today. They know how to get those soundbites out of a guest. And so when they're taking the time to go through Descript and clip those up and you know, get those great videos, they know that they can run that for a long while before it becomes even close to irrelevant.

[00:32:04] **Katie Fawkes:** So again, it's thinking through and they know the platform formerly known as Twitter is in the moment, right? So they could post that and Doc is probably going to see it a bunch because he's tagged in it. Ecamm is going to see it a bunch because we're tagged in it. But their people are probably only going to see it once every year, every couple of months, even if they're posting it a lot because of the immediacy of that platform.

[00:32:29] **Katie Fawkes:** So they're able to show the same content over and over and over again. It's not annoying. If they were to do that on Facebook and post it every, you know, every two hours, the same thing, everyone would see that a lot more often. They'd be like, okay, shut up, Jeff. We've heard this enough, right? So again, that's like, that is kind of one of those instances of really understanding how to maximize the content and save yourself time, but also really understanding the platforms and the ways to, to use those platforms effectively.

[00:32:54] **Katie Fawkes:** So same content that they're sharing in different platforms. But the frequency is increased on a platform that can handle it because of, you know, because of how that works. Yeah. And Jeff says, squeeze all that juice out of your content, y'all. Seriously. Like it, if you're going to take the time, right. Yeah.

[00:33:10] **Katie Fawkes:** If you're going to take the time to make it, get it out there. That has stayed the same, like speaking of takeaways, like that's been the takeaway since I don't even want to know how far back, like if you, you know, if you have those social platforms and you're creating content for them, You make that work for you as long as you possibly can, because you need a lot of content to keep people enticed and interested, and to keep, you know, to keep new people learning about you.

[00:33:35] **Katie Fawkes:** So, yeah, it's a good one.

[00:33:38] **Doc Rock:** There you go. There you go. Okay. So, my last takeaway, and this is something that I, you know, it's a little in the, what I used to call it, inside baseball, but I think it's important to know I had an opportunity at one of the podcast shows, it was Podcast Movement in Denver, to get a better understanding of how The search for your podcasts work.

[00:34:02] **Doc Rock:** Mmm, yep. Because a lot of people are busting their tail and they're trying to figure this out and It's really simple and believe it or not The number one aggregator is still Apple regardless of what everyone else tells you Apple still the biggest It's a lot of the other places get their search and sort criteria from Apple because it's a thing as a Developer when you go to build your podcast app, which by the way gay before we end this Let me tell you my new secret squirrel podcast app it they get the information from Apple.

[00:34:33] **Doc Rock:** So they just pass it along So they're not reinventing the wheel because the wheels already be invented by somebody who got the billion dollars to build the search back in So why rebuild it when Apple allows you to use it? You know, I mean so is as follows It goes by the title of that episode, right, the author, and then the number of followers all time.

[00:34:57] **Doc Rock:** So that's why sometimes there's shows who hasn't put out a new episode in six years But when you go to search for a true crime podcast, Serial still comes up in the search. And it's because of the number of followers all the time, right? So you do have to understand that while you're coming up with your titles for your episodes and think to yourself Is it super helpful in the main portion of the title to have episode 358?

[00:35:30] **Doc Rock:** Probably not. Not if you want to be searched right now, is it cool for your listeners to have a way to know what's next? Yes, I think that does help. But if you're still trying to grow like when you're a big podcast, you can get away with that stuff Everybody knows you you got millions of dollars with the advertisement behind you.

[00:35:47] **Doc Rock:** You don't have to follow any of these rules So don't be like well Joe Rogan does it Joe Rogan's it? Never mind. I'm not important. He he has money behind him He has a spin behind him and a platform that's actually paid him So they actually promote the show with or without him so you can't use those as those are the rules Those are not the rules His rules are completely separate and he doesn't understand that hashtag privilege.

[00:36:11] **Doc Rock:** So Yeah, don't don't get caught up in trying to follow what the big guys are doing They're probably not following any of the rules because they don't have to you do so just understand that title author number of followers all time and Thank you to Rob from Libsyn For holding me down and making me take it in because I was like, no man, but he's like, shut up doc.

[00:36:37] **Doc Rock:** No So Rob gave me to school and I got to give him props for that because that is the right answer Nothing we can do about it whether we like it or not. That's the answer

[00:36:47] **Katie Fawkes:** yeah and don't like that I think in this putting on my like SEO hat from years back when I was Doing tons and tons of training in this space it Don't get cute.

[00:36:59] **Katie Fawkes:** Don't get, don't get cute. Put it, you know, tell it as it is. Fill out every field. Read through things carefully. Like if, if a field exists as you are populating your show notes or in your podcast app. podcast host app or in, you know, when you're filling out YouTube, fill it out as accurately as you can, giving as much description as you can with real words, no fun puns or like weird, you know, things that you say and try to keep it as clear as possible because All of that helps, you know, helps all of the different search tools to be able to rank your content, get your content into the hands of the people that are looking for it, make your content more discoverable.

[00:37:45] **Katie Fawkes:** And that goes for whatever you're creating, whether, you know, it's a website or a blog post or anything, just try to try to make it as obvious as possible, as clear as possible and as detailed as possible. And, and if there is a field. Fill it out. Put the information into it so that, um, so that you're, you know, you're making the best use of it as you can.

[00:38:08] **Katie Fawkes:** I, um, I do think it makes a really big difference in being able to find a lot of this stuff. And yeah, Eden is saying so that SEO loves simplicity and concise ity. So yeah, try to make it as concise as you can, as simple as you can, and using the actual descriptive words and not any kind of like cute, fun play on words or puns or things that you would find funny if you were talking, but not if you were trying to find something.

[00:38:38] **Doc Rock:** Yes. I like, it was like, this is totally shreddable, don't get cute, but this is 100 percent fact, right? Those feels exist for a reason, so you really do have to spend some time to fill those out. Okay, Kates, what's your last takeaway?

[00:38:54] **Katie Fawkes:** Oh my goodness, alright, so this, this is one that I, I'm planning and hoping to actually do for this show, and I just did it for my own show.

[00:39:03] **Katie Fawkes:** Um, I'm, I'm looking to extend out and build a more detailed website. And so this, this kind of falls under the like, build your network, build your space, own your space, make it easy. Take away in conversation. I, um, for my own podcast was trying to like figure out whether or not we needed, you know, uh, our own URL and how I wanted to do it.

[00:39:26] **Katie Fawkes:** And I, you know, I was thinking about cost and, and, and my skillset and kind of all of the details that go into it. And, um, I ended up taking a recommendation from someone in the Ecamm community. So shout out and thank you to that space. But they recommended a tool called podpage. com. Um, and they are basically a website builder specifically for podcasts.

[00:39:46] **Katie Fawkes:** But in the, you know, in this conversation of like having a really good SEO and kind of connecting all of the dots, a tool like Podpage pulled in my podcast for my podcast host, pulled in YouTube and all of the videos from YouTube, helped me pull in my logos and my colors and everything. And within like about 15 minutes, Uh, and for pretty little investment, I was able to build like a really detailed, really professional looking site and it has everything under it, right?

[00:40:15] **Katie Fawkes:** So like this show, I'm on YouTube, I'm YouTube podcasting, I, you know, and we're live streaming and we're recording all of those fun, you know, movie shorts. And I'm, you know, I'm out on all the different podcast players. And so this one kind of central website pulls it all together and makes it really easy for people.

[00:40:32] **Katie Fawkes:** And it also unlocked a bunch of cool features that I would love to do for this show. You know, things like the ability to sign up and get email reminders, you know, when the, when the episodes are, um, It connected into X to be able to, you know, send X's tweets. I'm going to go with tweets when new, when new episodes

[00:40:51] **Katie Fawkes:** are available.

[00:40:52] **Katie Fawkes:** It still tweets to me. It, it

[00:40:54] **Katie Fawkes:** allowed me to do things like have a contact form. I could create, you know, short. Pretty links to be able to make it a little bit easier. I could list a gear guide. I could have, you know, voicemails from, uh, from our fans coming in. So it just, it unlocked a whole bunch of features.

[00:41:09] **Katie Fawkes:** And again, kind of in that one central space to allow me to own my space, allow me to kind of build and grow in one place that makes it really easy for everyone that's coming in. So. I would challenge you all, I guess my final takeaway is this idea of own, own your Oprah style network and like have a central place where people can find you and engage with you, because if you're in this YouTube space, which I hope you are, it does sort of split you in these, you know, it's like, Podcast players on one side and YouTube on the other side.

[00:41:41] **Katie Fawkes:** And I think you need to have both of those sides, but try to find a way to connect the dots for people so that they can find you and grow with you and learn with you and engage with your content.

[00:41:50] **Doc Rock:** Boom. See, look, this is just, these are just effects and I'm loving it. Alright, I don't know if this is a takeaway, but I do want to make sure that I cover this.

[00:42:01] **Doc Rock:** And then I'm going to tell the people that came to the live video audience about my Secret Scroll podcast app that everybody should know about. So you people ain't going to get to hear this, because you should come to the live tape. Anyway, listen, this is, this is, uh, Coach Doc for one second here. Be the business that you want to be like if you're really serious about this Okay, you're if you want to play and see if you like podcasting absolutely do that No pressure knock yourself up If you're trying to do this because you're trying to grow your business or be the business or add it to your repertoire increase your brand all of the above If you were going to start a new business selling potato stickers, like my niece Emma, uh, Stephanie's, not my, uh, mine, um, you can actually, you would have to invest in something.

[00:42:56] **Doc Rock:** Okay? So what do I mean by that? You would have to get a sticker machine, Cricut, whatever the case may be. You're going to have to get some vinyls from the Michaels, whatever the case may be. You're going to invest in a new inkjet printer or fix the one that you haven't used in 12 years in order to print the packaging that it goes in.

[00:43:16] **Doc Rock:** You're going to go to Michaels or wherever else, Job Lot, Kohl's, and get... The little cello bags to put all the stickers in. You're going to take your camera, take those photos, build that websites. You're going to get your Etsy store going. Okay. The absolute most frustrating thing to me, and I may not show my face, but I get legit pissed.

[00:43:39] **Doc Rock:** Somebody says. Oh, um, you know, they just recommended this, you know, 300 microphone and I really want it but I can't, yeah you can, yes you can, I guarantee you I can look at what you spend your money on and somewhere between the big gulps, the Starbucks, the whatever, something that you're doing, uh, driving to the grocery store which is one mile away instead of walking, uh, your doctor will love you, your heart will love you, your feet will love you, like there's a way, like there's legit a way.

[00:44:10] **Doc Rock:** A lot of those are just excuses because you're setting, uh, how do I explain this? You're setting up the failure excuse ahead of the game. We all watched this happen in real time. We saw somebody do this, knew that they were going to fail, so started talking about what's going to cause them to fail before they actually failed.

[00:44:28] **Doc Rock:** So now they have a reason to talk about why they failed. So, if you're telling yourself, having to buy Descript, or having to buy ChatGPT or having to buy a premium subscription to whatever, getting the pro version of Ecamm, uh, promo, right? Uh, whatever. Seeing, seeing that I can't afford that, but you're trying to do a business where you want to make money on it, You're already giving yourself the out to say you failed when you didn't do it.

[00:44:57] **Doc Rock:** So don't do that to yourself. Like, like, like, Stephanie literally just wrote this in the chat. Invest in your success. Now, I'm not telling you you have to be rich, and maybe this gonna be the last 300 you got in your pocket. But, anecdotally, when I decided to dive back into YouTube and do this full force, Okay, I just done my knee surgery and I knew I couldn't do my stand up work for like six months.

[00:45:21] **Doc Rock:** I mean, no wood shop, no laser engraving, no DJing, no weddings, no officiating. I could do nothing. I would just sit in my house, iced up and pissed. So, I decided I was gonna go back into this. What I did was I went and I said, I'm going to go get a brand new, uh, card to build this business on. And when I, when I went in, I said, I'm going to give myself a budget of 2, 500 bucks.

[00:45:51] **Doc Rock:** That's all I was going to do. That's all I was willing to invest in to reattempt this, this thing this time, cause I had spit and started YouTube like eight times prior and I didn't want to hear the fight from the little person. So I gave myself that number. And, I, I stuck to it. And then what did I do? I realized, yo, I was starting to make some income just from affiliates.

[00:46:17] **Doc Rock:** I signed up for Ecamm one day, searching the internet looking for where to get a discount code, because that's what I do, and it introduced me to some lady named Stephanie. I was like, who's this lady? Oh my gosh, she's a little much. She's cute, but, you know, she's a lot. And then, I, I. Got an email from her.

[00:46:38] **Doc Rock:** Hey, this is Stephanie. I used to come to this Leap Into Live streaming or whatever, and I was like, What? What the heck is a Leap Into Live streaming? So I watched those videos, I was getting my butt up at like 4 in the morning, and from that, I met Katie and Diana. Like, face I mean, not face to face, but, uh, zoom to face.

[00:46:56] **Doc Rock:** Zoom to face. I met Katie, Diana, Jeff, um, Owen, uh, Xaeli, like a lot of the people that we vibe with now literally met them in the conference like the second day I owned Ecamm and one of the things that Stephanie said was, Oh, you should sign up for the affiliate program. Again, shameless plug, I signed up for the affiliate program right then and there.

[00:47:19] **Doc Rock:** And before that week was out, I covered my entire 384 of Ecamm.

[00:47:25] **Katie Fawkes:** Yeah. This is like legit within the same week. Right now, I know we say all this is like, just start, just start right now. But what I'm saying to every single person on the heels of what the incredible story that Doc just said is that the holiday season starts now!

[00:47:43] **Katie Fawkes:** Like, if you've been thinking or like, if you've had on your list, like, I want to be... An Amazon affiliate, an Ecamm affiliate, like, if you've had affiliate marketing on your list at all and you have not checked it off the list, like, right now, before everyone and their brother is going to start shopping, is the time to do it.

[00:48:00] **Katie Fawkes:** Please, like, speaking literally as someone that finally just signed up to be an Amazon affiliate, on my own, for fun, to, like, make extra money, like, please. Now is the time to do it. All of these companies, including Ecamm, are pushing hard to get, you know, to get more sales over the holiday season. They want help from affiliates.

[00:48:21] **Katie Fawkes:** You could be an affiliate. You are all capable of being an affiliate. So right, like right, right now, like Doc is so right. It's. You know, there's only so many excuses. We did a whole episode about it last week.

[00:48:35] **Doc Rock:** Imagine me not signing up for Ecamm because I thought I couldn't afford that money, which I couldn't.

[00:48:40] **Doc Rock:** I wasn't working at the time. I was literally taking a sophisticated, wild ass guess. However, I trusted in me, right? I have done it before. I come from the hood. I could be poor. I could be poor again, and I still know how to do it, right? So, but taking that chance... Now I get paid to sit here and talk to y'all.

[00:48:58] **Doc Rock:** Yeah. That just, this whole thing could not have happened if I psyched myself out over not wanting to spend three hundred and eighty four dollars. Can you imagine that? That, that's dumb. I mean, that's just really dumb. And I'm not trying to say this to be mean, but this, this is the kind of thing that people psych themselves out over and then they say well I wish I had a, and they say well so and so, they got a big channel.

[00:49:25] **Doc Rock:** Every one of those people with a big channel started with a decision to spend something. It might have been the mic, it might have been the camera. It might've been that training class that they took, whatever, every person you look at right now that you like, they got this big channel and I love them.

[00:49:41] **Doc Rock:** They're my favorite. I want to be them. They all started making the decision to spend some money that they probably shouldn't have, but they did it because they trusted it themselves to do the right thing. And I listened to so many grown folks. I know where actual jobs and whatever. Just making excuses because to me that excuse is you don't want to afford it because you don't want to take the chance and fail.

[00:50:03] **Doc Rock:** But you know what? You already failed the minute you told yourself you can't. So I'm gonna stop coaching, but yes, please just do your thing. Just do your thing. Yeah.

[00:50:14] **Katie Fawkes:** And again, especially right now as we are heading into like the biggest buying season. Of the year, and everyone is trying to figure out, you know, what they need for their studio spaces, what gifts they want to get for the creators in their world, what, you know, like all of it.

[00:50:32] **Katie Fawkes:** It's a great, it's a really great time to be signing up for it. So, awesome final takeaway, Doc.

[00:50:37] **Doc Rock:** Nailed it. Yeah, so just remember affiliates, that's A F F I L A A T E S dot Ecamm, E C A M M M C O M. Like that's it. Sign up. And, uh, Stephanie just finished this off with a homerun swinger. She said, once you've mastered Ecamm, launch your own two hour intensive in charge for it.

[00:50:57] **Doc Rock:** You know, uh, Bradley had Ecamm for like a month and he realized a whole bunch of people wanted to know how to create graphics and keynote. And Bradley did a two day keynote, like for graphics intensive. And, if I remember correctly, he, that first time he did it, charging only like 40 bucks, he made over 11 grand?

[00:51:23] **Doc Rock:** True story. True story. And that first, I mean, he had, he came for like a month. So he went from, I don't know if I can afford to buy this pro thing. I'm gonna buy this pro thing, to take the 3 84 out, take whatever cameras I made him buy out and then made like 10 grand within the same month. So, I don't know, y'all could just keep making excuses, but I have this sign that I made for Emma when she was young.

[00:51:45] **Doc Rock:** It's still in her room. Because I want her to know how Uncle thinks about these things. Where, uh, losers make excuses, winners make it happen. Yep, absolutely.

[00:51:56] **Katie Fawkes:** Alright, well we did it, and speaking of, I guess, monetization, here are our sponsors, Doc. There's segue for the end of this episode.

[00:52:08] **Doc Rock:** Boom! And by the way, both of these guys, both of these guys have affiliate programs, so you can do that too.

[00:52:13] **Doc Rock:** Okay, anyway. They sure do. They sure do. This show is always brought to you by Captivate. Captivate. fm allows us to shine. Look, there's lots of platforms out there you can start your podcast on. However, what made me fall in love with Captivate is two fold. The CEO is a diehard Star Wars fan. Your bill will come from rebel based media.

[00:52:37] **Doc Rock:** So... Me and Mark was tight day one. However, no, they built their stuff around a growth mindset. So they have growth tools there to help you grow your podcast. And I thought it was funny. And so I remember having a chance to talk with Mark and ask him, why'd he do it this way? And because he has all the same standard features as any other, you know, podcast aggregator, he goes, but everyone's question is always, how do I get more listeners now?

[00:53:04] **Doc Rock:** How do I get more followers? How do I get more followers? And so he built in that growth mindset into the platform, captivate. fm, give it a try. I cannot speak highly enough about it. It is amazing. Now. I told you, don't be afraid to do video because video is easier than ever before, and our next sponsor, Descript, allows you to do such things.

[00:53:26] **Doc Rock:** Descript will take your video, turn it into a Word document that you can easily edit, so the moment when you're talking, and you say gefilte fish when you meant to say salmon, you can highlight gefilte fish, delete it. And change it to salmon and the script will fix it for you. You can even do a little slash in that say, add media and put in an actual photo or video of a salmon.

[00:53:51] **Doc Rock:** Dina has salmon swimming in her backyard. You just steal her video and stick it. No, I don't do that. She might get mad at you. Oh, but yes, you can actually just do it. It's so simple. You don't have to know how to cut your finals. You don't know how to premiere in Adobe. You don't have to do anything. Just open up the script.

[00:54:06] **Doc Rock:** If you can edit a word document, you can edit your video today. So, that is it. Back to the queen of segways. Don't forget that you can get your podcast at flow. ecamm. com. That is it. Flow. ecamm. com.

[00:54:26] **Katie Fawkes:** And this was our last episode of 2023. So if you are listening and it's past November 14th, 2023, it means that we are on working vacation.

[00:54:37] **Katie Fawkes:** I'm going with working vacation. We promised we would not take a break unless we were really going to make it worthwhile. So we are taking a break to build a hopefully a better, cooler, more detailed website and update a bunch of our thumbnails and our show notes and bring on some incredible guests and make sure we're diving deep into some of the topics that matter most to you.

[00:54:58] **Katie Fawkes:** So make sure that you email us at flow at ecamm. com if you have any great ideas, if you want to be a guest, if you really want to hear someone talk on podcasting and you don't know how to reach them, we will reach them for you. We will bring up some awesome people and we will see you back that first week of January.

[00:55:16] **Katie Fawkes:** But that does not mean that Ecamm is on working vacation, so hopefully you will check out all of the other incredible Ecamm shows. Many of which run weekly. So we always have cool, awesome, amazing content up for you. So yeah, happy, happy holidays from us. If you don't hear us say that before, later, but we we'll probably see you soon.

[00:55:39] **Doc Rock:** Almost naturally.

[00:55:40] **Katie Fawkes:** Oh, well, thanks doc. Thanks everyone. And we'll see you again in January.

[00:55:46] **Doc Rock:** Really, really good episode. Thank you so much. And, uh, oh, last thing, this is not a prog for us, but look at Stephanie's channel, just copy her name from the chat, and go watch the video she did yesterday, and then after you pick your jaw back up off the floor, send me a DM and be like, what in the hell is that, and how can I get Doc?

[00:56:05] **Doc Rock:** Yeah,

[00:56:06] **Katie Fawkes:** she's doing some, watch that space. She's doing some cool

[00:56:08] **Doc Rock:** stuff. Yo, she was killing me yesterday. I was like, this is so cool. So hopefully we're gonna have her on the show to talk about it soon. But anyway, go check it out. Appreciate it. Mahalo! Bye everyone! Flow Riders! Out!